dlhoboda archovacia :: Remember, remember, the velvet November


node:	dlhoboda archovacia
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parent:	HARDWARE :::
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created:	15.09.2016 - 21:11:12

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tom_myto

Ake su v sucasnosti moznosti nejakej dlhodobej archivacie dat pre osobne pouzitie?

Mam na mysli nejaky hw, ktory si raz kupim (tj. nemusim za to stale platit ako napr. cloud), nahram to tam a za 10 rokov to pojde prehrat na nieco ine ...

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Toto je tazka otazka a asi nie je jedina spravna odpoved.
Ak pojdes do fyzickeho media tak rataj stym,ze by si mal mat minimalne na dvoch miestach pre pripad poziaru/vykradnutia/vytopenia/atd.

Ja to zatial riesim hardiskami, ale nie je to dokonale riesenie.
Cloud je pre mna drahy a neprakticky,kedze potrebujem mat backupnutych tak 8TB(a rastie to).

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myslim ze pre teba ma google celkom ok riesenie:
https://cloud.google.com/storage/archival/

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Kuknem.
Ale stale je to komplikovane. Uploadnut par TB netrva chvilu plus kedze im neverim tak by som musel vsetky fotky dat aspon do zaheslovaneho raru.

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no jo, urcite si brusia zuby na tvoje fotky... :D

s tym zaheslovanim a celkovym managementom ti urcite rad pomoze kdejaky nerd.

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problem dlhodobej archyvacie je cena.
podla mna najlepsia moznost teraz je proste cloud.
ak neveris cloudu spolahliva dlhodoba archyvacia (10rokov) bude financne podla mna dost draha

Zabudni na nejake DVD BR a podobne blbosti na 10 rokov by som tam nenahral ani pecko.
HDD urcite nie pokial teda planujes tam nieco nahrat a odlozit to na 10rokov a potom pouzit.
Pasky su OK ale tam je problem ze ich treba prehravat aby nestratili informacie

primarny problem ked to mas doma bude ako dole pisu morealne zastaravanie. Za tych 10 rokov proste ta technologia nemusi existovat.

jo a teda neviem o akych mnozstvach sa bavime samozrejme

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https://hardware.slashdot.org/story/16/08/28/2016242/ask-slashdot-whats-the-best-way-to-backup-large-amounts-of-personal-data

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mozes si objednat tzv neobmedzeny backup, napriklad u
https://www.backblaze.com/
a oni potom maju sluzbu, ze ti poslu domov harddisk (alebo flash) s tvojimi datami. tento harddisk prakticky stoji ako keby si kupil novy v obchode. cize kazdych par rokov si nechas za 50$ poslat terovy harddisk a ten si hodis na policku alebo do suflika.
https://www.backblaze.com/restore.html

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http://www.extremetech.com/computing/92286-m-disc-is-a-dvd-made-out-of-stone-that-lasts-1000-years

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pozri aj toto forum na to urcene:
https://kyberia.sk/id/7761838

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nas + hitachi 7k4000
http://www.storagereview.com/hgst_ultrastar_7k4000_review_hus724040ale640
ak mas neobmedzeny rozpocet tak ten disk si kup s enterprise licenciou, s ktorou dostanes 10y warranty + data recovery free

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dik. zatial to mam poriesene podobne s wd diskami (lnk) a hw fici super.
problem je skor v tom, ze pravdepodobne synchronizacna utilita od synology mi zmazala asi 60GB fotiek bez ulozenia do trashu (alebo sa tento automaticky vymazal) - co sa riesi momentalne cez support.
jo, bol som lenivy vymenit externy hd na TM (alebo ho prehodit na NAS), ktory mi pred rokom odisiel, moja chyba.

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hlavny problem je moralne zastaravanie technologii, nik ti nezaruci to ze nejaka sucasna technologia bude fungovat alebo sa bude dat skonvertovat na nieco o 10 rokov (skor nie). zober si magnetofonove pasky, alebo nedaj boze MD. cize bud si nechat aj zariadenie co to dokaze prehrat (HW so specifickym SW), najlepsie asi s analogovym vystupom (da sa zdigitalizovat do akejkolvek buducej formy), alebo ratat s problemami - muzealne zariadenia budu stale drahsie a tazsie zohnatelne. Povedal by som ze jedina moznost je si to sledovat. Strategia by mala byt - mat to minimalne 3x zalohovane na rozdielnych typoch medii +online, najlepsie na roznych sluzbach. A asi najlepsie dat si reminder napr. raz za dva roky to checknut, ked je problem zmenit medium/cloud sluzbu.

Moja skusenost s cloudom - nemusis za to platit, su sluzby ktore maju 50Gb free na jeden ucet pripadne sa tvaria ako unlimited. Mne jeden taky cloud raz zachranil vsetky starsie fotky, jediny problem bol ze som si len nahodou spomenul ze som to tam daval :)

asi by som momentalne zvolil strategiu 1x SSD, 1x HDD (alebo nejake opticke medium) 2x free cloud sluzby. Nechat si HW na prehratie a vsetko dobre zaznamenat hlavne ked to na cloud zasifrujes.

e: pozeram ze moznosti je momentalne dost:
http://blogthinkbig.com/cloud-storage-services-that-offer-more-space-for-free/
ja som konkretne uz dost davno pouzil aDrive ktory stale funguje a fotky tam prezili viac ako 5 rokov na (dvoch uctoch lebo som potreboval viac ako 50Gb)

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znie zaujimavo.
aby som sa priznal, k optickym mediam chovam hlboku nedoveru. mal som volakedy velku zbierku DVDcok s filmami, takmer vsetky odisli.

ale ten napad si to porozhadzovat po cloudoch nie je tak uplne zly.

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The standard hard drive warranty runs about 5 years. That number is assuming regular use, so if a drive were to be plugged in and have data written to it infrequently, and stored in a dry space with optimal temperatures, there's no reason that it couldn't last far longer than that—in the range of seven or even eight years. Always keep the drive safe from large magnetic fields, since they could help to degrade the data much more quickly, and keep that temperature rule in mind, since there are movable parts with grease that could dry up and crack in the wrong conditions. The actual temperature range varies from drive to drive, but keeping it somewhere between 10°C and 45°C degrees is a pretty safe bet.
http://lifehacker.com/5808858/how-long-can-a-hard-drive-hold-data-without-power

Asi najlepšie externý USB disk, niečo takéto, samozrejme vyber si kapacitu akú potrebuješ:
https://www.alza.sk/seagate-expansion-desktop-3000gb-d2418318.htm?catid=18843102

A ak Ti na tých datach naozaj tak záleží tak si kúp rovno dva alebo tri a na každý nahraj to isté a ulož ich na rôzne miesta kvôli pípadnému požiaru alebo krádeži.

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HDD

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ok, ale aj ked hdd bude povedzme stat a nebude zapojeny - dochadza takto k degradacii kvality zaznamu ako u DVD alebo mag. pasok?

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no, pokial viem na dlhodobu archivaciu su stale industry standardom skorej magnetofonove pasky.

k odmagnetizovavaniu sice dochadza, ale pri digitale to nie je taky problem ako pri analogovom signale.

pre osobne pouzitie ale asi skore tie hdd. nejaky NAS a vhodny RAID

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jo, mam NAS s RAID1.

inak ako dlho vydzri SSD? kapacity su uz celkom ok, pokial sa nezmeni rozhranie, tak by to mohlo byt dostupne aj po rokoch, nie?

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http://superuser.com/questions/468681/how-long-will-a-solid-state-drive-ssd-keep-its-data-while-not-in-use

Programmed floating-gate memories cannot store information forever. Vari- ous processes (such as field-assisted electron emission and ionic contamination) cause the floating gate to lose the charge, and these go faster at higher tem- peratures. Another failure mode in the very thin tunnel oxides used in Flash memories is programming disturb, where unselected erased cells adjacent to se- lected cells gain charge when the selected cell is written. This is not enough to change the cell threshold sufficiently to upset a normal read operation, but could cause problems to the data retention time and should be considered during mea- surement of the threshold voltage of the cells for data analysis and information recovery. Typical guaranteed data retention time for EPROM, EEPROM and Flash memories are 10, 40 and 100 years, respectively.

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na ssd ked zapises tak by tie data ked ho potom vypnes by mali vydrzat mrte dlho - tj skorej sa dostanes do stavu ze uz nebude existovat HW interface skrz ktory to budes vediet pripojit ako to ze sa z toho stratia data